How can you define the feeling of standing at a pivotal moment in the history of music? That is the feeling you should get when listening to the new SKINNY PUPPY album, The Greater Wrong of the Right, blasting out of the speakers. The history of this band is far too diverse and detailed to sum up in these few inches of paper. To be brief, they rose from an obscure performance art/nu wave/electronic/industrial rock band to become the most obscure and yet wildly popular group that has influenced hundreds, if not thousands, of bands with diverse backgrounds from all over the world. Full bios of the boys are widely available on dozens of official and fan sites. Look it up.

Millions of fans were teased by the now legendary live performance in Dresden, Germany at the DOOMSDAY festival (2000). Then a blip on the radar with the exclusive track “Optimized” slid onto the Underworld movie and subsequent soundtrack warned of the proximity of a full album in the pipeline, their first new album in over a decade.
 

This month the album The Greater Wrong of the Right arrives. I warn you, this is not a regurgitated zombie of the same SKINNY PUPPY now over a decade dead. This is a resurrection, climbing to a new level, the next logical step in the progression of their ever-evolving sound. The influence of Ogre’s solo experience is undeniable, ghosts of Key’s haunting solo work creep in, harsh reminders of the turmoil evoked in the PROCESS flicker in and out, undertones of the dark classic sound lying just beneath. The lot all merge together in a brilliant calamity.



For SKINNY PUPPY, this album is a testament to their brilliant triumph over chaotic years filled with tendencies of personal annihilation, natural disasters, and the passing of a dear friend. For us, it means hearing the cumulative product of some of the most prolific musical artists of our generation.


This is an album worth taking the time to sink deep into. Ogre’s vocals now more clear and purposeful than in his more cryptic days. Crossover styles of power dance tracks like ‘Pro-Test,” and “Past/Present,” the very radio friendly “Use Less,” topped off with the hands down unanimous favorite track “DaddyuWarbash” all mingle together making this release poised to take on the fractured Dark Alternative scene, as well as draw into the fold an entirely new generation of PUPPY fans. Whether you are just discovering Ogre’s always unusual vocal style, or a long time fan of Key’s sharp programming you will find something to appreciate on The Greater Wrong of the Right.


The following pages contain interviews with Ogre by Max Michaels and with Cevin Key by Nathanael Thorin. On the side line of the articles are the lyrics to all of the tracks off The Greater Wrong of the Right, which were sent to us by Ogre. A very special thanks to both of these amazing artists. It has been an honor for MOVEMENT to cover their careers for the past 12 years, we look forward to 12 more.


 

"I REACQUAINTED MYSELF WITH A LOT OF  THINGS. I IMMERSED MYSELF IN THAT  EMOTIONAL TURMOIL THAT WENT AWAY SO  LONG AGO, AND NOW IT'S REARED IT'S UGLY HEAD AGAIN. "

      

  - N I V E K   O G R E

 

"IT'S A POLITICAL ERA, ESPECIALLY BEING CANADIAN LIVING IN AMERICA. YOU FEEL LIKE YOU'RE ON A ROLLERCOASTER WITH NO CONTROL OF THE BRAKES. "

      

     - C E V I N   K E Y


 

..

..

'The
GREATER WRONG
of the RIGHT"
LYRICS









I’MMORTAL
Just looking for something is what to say keep looking at nothing to go away you take my picture a portrait prize behind my image your father’s eyes just looking for something NOW it looks like something from far away inside the image grows and makes the shadow fade behind the image posted on your wall a crack is hiding fighting for it all just looking for something NOW we’ve taken it somewhere from far away the voices echo from yesterday behind the crack behind the image on the wall I see you curled up tightly hiding from it all just looking for something NOW








PRO-TEST
hit me on the street while waiting to do nothing where within the space can anything feel certain look into the future make out the word speak send in the spies to watch them creepy are the people unable to do something sitting on an armchair fenced in their creation look up to be there anywhere is somewhere itchy past scratch the itch hit me in the streets hit me feel about a nation so precious is the freedom carousel the brass ring reach into a black mass so its corroded always polluted we all want some of it maybe all the people now left without no loving where within the strength gone better see it coming get off the fence trip rip up the garbage make it up to the earth bitch hit me in the streets hit me be a politician eroding all your freedoms down the rabbit hole cracks money markets fall through a looking glass time becomes too fast all to benefit the rich so keep eating from the apple edges from the center shaken to the core until it doesn’t matter no one to turn to no where to run to better the bomb to blow it HIT ME in the streets









EMPTE
beat my head to wake up cause I feel as if I’m sleeping past is in the heart and I am waiting for the rhythm feed the holy jaws no saying pain is the answer after all is gone the story leaves me feeling empty and all alone it leaves me feeling emptE breathe we are all animals inside free the spirit is alive to guide us we’re all alone and really feeling empty we’re all alone when all revenge falls apart taken a step back from the start leaves me feeling empty IT









NEUWERLD
neuwerld order pissing on a river on the way a long tomorrow rancid waters picking up the remnants of a flower in all of us exists the touch of deadly warming global and trust we must distrust the owners of the new world order what of the hour of the whole look what you’ve been missing feed upon the fingers chew the knuckle to the bone dig inside the crack beside the pain that is a home live a distant second skin whatever else that can fed upon the remnants of a life that’s never had he took a living thing and made a copy of it an image put the finish on a life still being made the secret twist invading mists the desert once a forest can’t see the forest for the death within the tree inside the crack beside the pain that is a home









GHOSTMAN
give it up today average levitation mojo no magic dedicated delusion give it all away oh yeah mother theresa all of it for the good of everyone never really ever really happens life is all distorted reasons are purported what we share with everyone nothing every little boy and girl is under everything is wrapped up tight underneath the spell what is discovered everything is wrapped up tight every little thing that is discovered did it ever really happen









DOWNSIZER
attached in awe what a whiplash hate filled culture of viruses born raised and infected with violent thought to set it off defend the wrong incite the thing to bring it down the panic of in a moments time bomb the artful dodge to fabricate a polarizing opposite political intention to keep it poor without a choice so full of fear a peoples voice carve a scar warm clotting of meat the maker of the hollow cost kept pockets picked of all moral law to face the truth were banished from a history of then is wrong defend the wrong incite the thing to bring it down








PAST/PRESENT
is this pure reality could we be led to believe lemmings up against a sea drowning in speculation even told when waters older more polluted never drink the murky media to plumb the depth of time what of human frailty visualize with clarity past the sanitation to childish flesh and bone bleaching sticks and stoner ribs pukes up gallows laughter stage the mighty media blessing this sanitation what is this supposed to hold freedoms crush disparaged souls despot dug in yellowcake and failed to certify it crippled son to pass it on a hatred fed on hatred born deify defensive form as if to never see that what is real canned I feel less important than today anyway is it worth the slaughter? Sit and feel absolutely zero suffering a condition worth denying pasted carcass killing fields body parts off dolls that bleed who was once committed for pulling wings off flying things feeling bold to knot put over twisted ever after hissing faded left alone to replicate the lie what is real asks the dream some dim shift a rift within funniest seems a distant the damp ring fitting end destitution ego death within a condition dear dementia
 

N I V E K
O  G  R  E


Fantastic... wow, a new Skinny Puppy... I'm so excited. It is a dream come true.
"I hope we didn't disappoint."

Absolutely not... This is probably the most momentous event in our music scene...
"Oh, thank you."

Not to blow any smoke up your ass or anything...
"No that's nice... we appreciate that."

Well, we love you guys. You've influenced so much in my art and my life and everything else just by your contribution, by what you do naturally... we definitely appreciate it.
"Yeah... I've been known to wonder about that. I'm in the midst of this shit going 'what is this thing?'"

How are you handling it?
"It's a bit crazy right now. How do you resurrect a demonic entity?"

I'm sure there's enough cheesy horror movies you could watch that'll tell you how to do that.
"It's more trying to overcome the idea of something that drained you so much in the past. The fear of succumbing to that the same way will happen again. Then trying to get to the point where I'm starting to see that the energy is there and it can flow through you, as opposed to deplete you. That's kind of where I'm coming from. I reacquainted myself with a lot of things. I immersed myself in that emotional turmoil that went away so long ago, and now it's reared its ugly head again."

You can really hear all the stuff it seems you guys have learned while away from each other. It really complements this release.
"That's good. Cause we went through a whole series of talks about what we should do and how we should approach it. Then all that talk came down to doing what seemed natural as opposed to trying to, in some way, recreate something that doesn't seem genuine in the long run. Because Skinny Puppy was really always about what's happening at the time. Trying to create that sense of drama that was Last Rights or trying to recreate that, which we didn't really intend to create, becomes kind of an exercise in duplication and facsimile and isn't really moving forward.
Ultimately we're not completely dark people. We're both exploring a lot of these things and we're fascinated by it and are hoping to find some sort of peace of mind as well. We both have had issues with things that, when we were younger, we didn't even notice or didn't allow to come to the surface. Things that were buried so deep inside that they were the catalyst for a lot of the problems we were having internally. We were just unable to deal with those things in a mature way at that time."

It seems you are exploring it in a lot more extroverted way. There's a heavy tension in your lyrics about the state of the world these days.
"Yeah, in a way. I'm trying to do it in a real abstract way. I don't want to be seen as someone who is just dissing the Right or whatever that construct is, because to me there's no real bilateralism in this country right now. There's two sides of the same coin and it seems like the far left is just in the center. I wanted to explore that from my own personal sense of growing up in the world that always led me to believe that we were protectors, liberators, do-gooders. Ultimately, if we apply the same rules that we apply to every other terrorist nation that we see... if we turn the mirror around on ourselves, then we become the leading terrorist nation."

I literally said that yesterday. If we applied the same rules and regulations that we expect from other countries, we'd be bombing our own American cities.
"We'd be bombing Boston because it sends money to the IRA. "

It's amazing and it terrified me. I was watching the Rumsfeld hearing a little while ago and it's just terrible.
“That really brings the title, which I was having a problem with. I hate to say it, I don't gloat about these things, but today I was in bed watching what's going on with the treatment of the prisoners and it truly is an example of the Greater Wrong of the Right. So I was kind of going 'is this some spaghetti western title I'm coming up with?' when I came up with it over a year ago. When I started, I was doing a lot of research into what we do and how it pertains to what other countries do and it's not just the Bush administration or the Bush oligarchy that's been going on for over centuries. They're basically arms dealers.
Even during Clinton's watch, they went after a pharmaceutical plant in Sudan in 1988. Some woman, some talking head on the news, mentioned an aspirin factory that was supplying cheap drugs. The amount of deaths that happened because of that plant being destroyed... they don't even report the numbers of people that were affected by things like that. The herdsmen and all the people that contract diseases from the animals and just couldn't get medicine anymore, and the children... it's heinous. The expression of cruelty within that is so vast and yet it's totally overlooked. There are so many indiscretions like that."

That's the problem with the world today...
"There's too many..."

And people are too content to go 'OK you've given me some sort of half-ass superficial explanation for it. I'll accept that!'
"Exactly. Or people will gravitate toward the most easily beneficial. UCLA did a study with a cross reference of people and basically people would turn their heads to something very specific if it affected their standard of living or their income. They would gladly turn away from the reality of the situation. I think that at some point, this idea of New World Order and global economy have to falter at some point. It falters on these countries that make all this stuff we buy really cheap. It's starting to happen here too. It's starting to creep into this country. It's going to be too late when it happens. It started happening in Argentina years ago and we're seeing similar things starting to creep in here."

It's a bad state of affairs. We're screwed. What can we really do to change things?
"We've grown up in this. Some people are quite content to vilify and keep doing all of the things that keep the stars on the flag shiny. I think there's a majority of people who are invested in this construct in a lot of ways whether they like it or not. It's amazing how many people will stand up and just kind of blindly say the 'right' thing. I think that's what freaks me out more. I grew up post-WWII with the biggest question of the 20th century: How could a country let that happen? How could the holocaust happen? And that's one of the biggest unresolved concept of the 20th century, how a completely modern nation could allow that to happen."

Have you seen The Conspiracy? It's an HBO film with 14 or 15 nazis sitting around a table deciding the fate of millions. I think that's exactly what's happened. We've got 14, 15 guys sitting around a table at the White House...
"And arrogant motherfuckers sitting around the White House too."

Well, back to better things...how are plans for the tour going?
"Going really well, better than expected. [We’re] actually selling out shows. We're doing a bunch of big shows overseas, headlining some festivals, and then we're doing a show in Amsterdam, a show in Paris, maybe two shows in London, I'm not sure yet. And then we're taking some time off and going out again, probably a festival in Australia and then maybe Asia."

How's the line-up for the live show? Obviously it's you and Cevin, but are you going to have anybody else?
"We have a pretty extensive visuals team this time around, so a lot of contributors there. And then we have a drummer, a friend of Cevin's named Justin, who's played with Thrill Kill Kult, and then Cevin will have his little widget set-up that he's going to be doing and will be stepping back from drumming, which I think is a great thing. It was good to see him the other day rehearsing and his set-up. We actually started rehearsals this week."

You've got the album of the show that you did in Dresden for Doomsday. Was there ever a video of that?
"I think it was filmed by a German company and then Nettwerk kind of dropped the ball when it came time to actually put the money up to do the DVD. I'm not sure if we still have access to that footage because apparently they wrote a few times. There was a bit of confusion with them coming out to do it and then wanting to get paid afterwards. I might have some of that footage here, but we'd have to get approval again. We actually wanted to do a bit of an extended disc and we actually might have a re-release with some of that stuff on it if we can get it."

That's be great. I've seen some of those photos and I was like...Oh wow...
"That was pretty cool. There's something I did on stage that day that I would never be able to do night after night because I would most certainly hurt myself seriously. I fell about 20 feet..I did it on purpose and did it successfully, but I'm sure that if I did it every night I'd end up killing myself."

Yeah we've talked before about your previous injuries onstage.
"Yeah... yeah..."

I spoke with Thomas Kuntz [see Movement back issue 08.03 online] to see what he was doing... are you guys going to do any kinds of crazy robot effects?
"No, Thomas is really busy right now. Just cause of the way things are and the economy and stuff like that. That was a one-up show so that robot was basically built here, taken apart, and rebuilt over there in the course of three days. The chances of taking something like that on the road and having it work night after night, it becomes a real issue. But that kind of stuff was more of a one-up sort of thing and this is much more video-heavy. "

What made you guys decide on SPV as your label?
"We were looking at two other labels and they came in rather late. There was a problem with them at one time, and we didn't consider them a possible contender. And then we met their whole crew and they were really awesome people. We came to the agreement business-wise and then it seems like they've been really on top of everything. The quality control has been really good, the stuff that they've done in the lab and the way they've been releasing stuff has been pretty pro. It's definitely helped in creating a buzz and they've been really great after they heard the record with coming to the table to do a video. We're shooting a video this month, on the 18th. "

What song are you doing it for?
"For Protest."

Ah! Good. Yay.
"It's gonna look really fucking cool. It'll be interesting. We're going to challenge people a little bit with it. I'm not gonna let the secret out of the bag just yet."

Sometimes I'm listening to the new album and I'm still going, ‘Cevin? Ogre? Oh wait...Skinny Puppy!’ It's a little schizophrenic. It's great though, and I love it. Just every now and then, the influence of the projects you both have done outside of Puppy pop up and rear their heads, and then it mergers right back into this new vision.
"I think we've got a really good core writing group. We've got a really good production person in Mark Walk who kind of watches over things, because we've actually produced a lot of this stuff as we go along and the process that we did this by is the different styles of writing kind of clashing and then pulling different stuff out."

What was the writing process for you guys this time around?
"Cevin comes up with his ideas musically. They're seeds of ideas. We take those and write, reformat, and abstract that. Within that, we find a vocal melody and build on that. We write music around that and then send it back to Cevin. And he further writes into it again, taking it to the next level.
Then it was passed off to Ken Marshall, who did a lot of our mixing in the past. He went through every track, pretty anally, and made sure there were no mistakes, bringing everything up to a pseudo-mixed-state at his home studio. Then we went down to Sonikwire Studios in Orange County and did the final mixes there. Even though the songs were kind of produced when they left here, a lot of production was done in that sense, but the final mixes were done in the studio."

When you sit down with a song, do start writing lyrics for the song itself or do you have pre-written lyrics you pull from?
"This album came really easy for me; I don't know if that's bad or good. I used to really struggle with Skinny Puppy lyrics. I think there's been a noticeable change in that. I think I'm simplifying things more. There's not that heavy cryptic flow that there was in the past. I like writing that stuff, but I'm more challenged right now by getting across meanings in simpler ways.
It's still not totally simple. I love to find word play within things. I love to find subtle abstractions and take it away from an obvious meaning, but at the same time, I'm attempting to move toward a more obvious meaning, especially with the theme of the record and less effects on the voice. It becomes a challenge for me to do that. That's the approach I took, and most of the writing comes from standing in front of a microphone acting like a complete idiot. You really have to hold your pants well below your ankles and let your balls swing in the wind and whatever comes out, comes out.
Sometimes things come out pretty good and that's kind of the catalyst for the rest of it. It basically comes down to - I hate to sound so mechanical- it comes down to syllables, the proper enunciation, and the pacing of the melody. Once you lock into that, it becomes really easy for me to write things down. I was more into trying to find connecting bridges between verses and subtle connections between ideas within the songs that might be varied within the song from the core theme. For example, songs like “Downsizer” have that sort of connected rhyming from verse to verse."

You really explore vocal styles. You've got this sort of rap thing going on at times that I think would put most hip-hop artists to shame. It's so fresh and it's actually a style I've been waiting to hear for a long time.
"Well, that's cool. It's weird, a lot of people are calling that rap and I didn't intend it that way. There's a certain technique that's being done within that, a studio technique, that I've realized a lot of rap artists use. So there's those things you can do within the editing process to make that even more interesting. The hardest thing for me with that is how that's going to come across live. I'm looking forward to doing that. It's a real challenge. It's exciting."

I was wondering about that too. I could hardly read along with the lyrics for “Ganja” online.
"Well, “Ganja” is sped up. We won't be doing that live. I can almost do that live. Cevin wanted to do it but I was like, ‘man... let's just hold off on that until we get going on this a little bit, because that's gonna be a bit longer anyway.’ There's so much to learn and relearn, and I'm taking a different approach on things vocally.
There's actually going to be someone on stage that can help me out with certain doubling things and harmonies that I've never had before, which I'm really excited about. I want to work out all that stuff in advance, so there's a lot of stuff to do. I'm pretty confident I could do “Ganja” with a lot of work. It's right on the edge. That was created as a studio track in the first place. Cevin did a great job of abstracting that track from where Mark and I had taken it before. He deconstructed it and when I heard it afterwards... he did a brilliant job with it."

It's one of my favorite songs on the album. It's so different. “Past Present” has a more dance style, “Useless” sounds pretty radio friendly, DaddyuWarbash is the gem, but “Ganja” is just over there all on its own.
"’[With “Useless”], the chorus came secondary to the verses and we had that thing going on in the verses musically. I've always wanted to do something like that, and it worked for me in the voice I chose to use and it became this little pop number, I guess. The purists are going to look at it and [think] just because Wayne [Static] is involved... it's new metal. Wayne's just a friend. Wayne was, and is, a Skinny Puppy fan. He's in a band (Static X) that's doing really well. Literally we just had a night here and he was really helpful to the whole texture of the song. The guy's voice is really good for that kind of stuff, and we ended up blending it anyway. I can see where people get freaked out by that kind of stuff, but hey, that's the challenge."

It's got Danny [Carey, Tool’s drummer] on there too...
"Yeah, Danny's been a long time friend of Cevin's, and mine in a way. I've always seen him at Pigface. He's a really good person. "

I'm especially excited about this release because the dark alternative scene is sorely in need of something like this and you guys, who are such a huge part of its history, coming back into the fold to do something new... it's pretty important. I think the diversity is what's really great about this release. Static-X fans will get it. Tool fans will pick it up. We've actually just added a search engine to our website and started to search out all the stuff we've done... and we've noticed just how many artists pop up that reference Skinny Puppy as an influence.
"Wow..."

It's a ton of 'em. You've influenced most of the bands that are out there right now that we listen to and feature in the magazine.
"That's very strange. You make me feel very old and very content."

I think this could bridge the gap for us all in expanding and broadening the scene because it's got diversified style. You have the history of the diehard fans from the past and you're gonna hit a whole new slew of kids.
"Well, now’s the time. It seems like whenever the Republicans are in power, the amount of disenfranchised youth builds [up] again. People want to act out because they're feeling out of control."

I'm hoping it'll be similar the Rave scene in England where it got really super huge and big festivals and then it caught on in America and the House scene just exploded over here. Hopefully with the Dark Alternative scene being so huge in Germany right now and all the big festivals and everything else...most of my friends order all of their music from Germany because they can get it quicker, cheaper...
"And the packaging's better..."

They get limited edition stuff. There's a lot of people that order online, they read Sideline and they get all the new music from Europe directly, because it's just not in supply over here.
"It's really odd to me how, for an example, we really noticed the difference on this side this time. At one point, we really had something going over here and it dissipated somehow. I don't know what did it. I guess more or less Marilyn Manson. I'm not saying he did something, but that was where it peaked. And I'm not sure that it peaked in the right way."

Well, you know he also perpetrated on your whole stiltwalking thing.
"He did, the bastard."

I love the new imagery, by the way, the pictures I've seen online of you guys with the posies are priceless.
"We're entering that period of time where parody and caricature start to enter into everything, so we decided to make a conscious effort to take hold of that ourselves. It was kind of interesting because that shot with the posies that came out first... it was a gas to do, ‘cause first we had a completely blue sky, but we toned it down a bit to have a little bit of blue sky. Right in the horizon there's an anal fissure of blue sky."

The looks on your faces are just the best.
"It was done for that reason. We thought, ‘this is taking a chance but why not take hold of all this and totally present our own caricatures?’ And so we did. I don't remember the name of the band, but we saw their promo shots and it was one of those really serious photoshopped jobs. They're all standing intensely wearing cybergoth clothing with these poses with all these magical alchemical symbols floating above them in this pseudo 3-D world, and it just looked silly to me. It was more like a high fashion magazine. I think that one shot of us is special because it levels the playing field, and I think that's what we're trying to do all the way around by challenging people. Don't expect to know what we're going to do."

I saw one release, I think it was a Back and Forth, it had a Japanime version of you guys on the back of it.
"That was done by one of our fans, one that Cevin knows who does cover art. Those are awesome cartoon characters."

Yeah, that was so sharp. I thought that person really got you guys down pat.
"Totally. And that kind of stuff is totally fine. There's probably a time when I would have been like, ‘I can't be shown like that,’ but it is what it is. "

Well, thank you for speaking with me again. Everything looks like it's going well and we're going to do our best to help perpetuate that even more.
"Yeah, thank you very much. Everything's going really good and the spirit is definitely there and we're really excited to get going again."